Saturdays Performance

[Joe]

It's not as if the team isn't aware of their faults, but nonetheless I feel like raising a few points for fan discussion.

Kicking posession away - WHY? There were so many times at the weekend when we would find ourselves in a good position yet we'd try and kick into touch or chip the ball down the wings. I don't know whether it's inexperience or nerves, but this is something we must stop doing.

Unless we are certain that that chip is going to be picked up by our own player, or that we will definitely put it into touch, we have got to cut it out because it's destroying the good work we are actually doing.

Similarly, we need to use the width of the pitch more - one stand out moment was when the entire back line was ready yet we decided to keep trying to maul forward (even though we were just past the halfway line!). The result - we ended up being pushed into touch and lost posession.

We must keep hold of that ball like our lives depend on it, and kick it away only when there is no other option.

On the plus side, we yet again ran the second half and won it 17-7. The New Zealander did a good job in the lineouts too and will undoubtedly help us out as this is an area we have, and still are, struggling in.

We're also starting to look a bit more bulky and strong - our weight was what killed us at Morley and Macclesfield but thankfully, I see that being slowly evened out.

We're not going to beat Preston on Saturday, but we can give them a hell of a game if we stop making these critical errors.

Come on lads, show us how good you really are! :-)

[Jon B]

I wonder if the bulk is coming from the new menu available at the ground on match days

Who ate all the pies

[martin]

In response to Joe's thoughts, I cannot agree. Rugby is about playing to your strengths and putting pressure on the opposition.

From my observations of Saturdays performance:
Strengths
Scrummaging
tackling close to ruck
winning first phase possession


Weaknesses
no pace in the backs
lack of tactical kicking
lack of strong, first up defence in backs.
inability to build phases

Therefore, in my opinion, I think that it may have been better to keep a more tight controlled game, going forward through the pack and using the centres as 'crash-ball' runners to get the forwards going forwards.

Also you need a fly half or scrum half that can accurately kick to the corners to keep the opposition in the own quarter. If that had happened on Saturday Hull would have crumbled under the pressure. Just shifting the ball to the backs to run is not the answer, they lack the pace and far too often ran laterally, no-one seemed capable of changing an angle or going through the defensive line.

In defence the backs were woeful, it seemed that there were three different systems in use at any one time. The inside backs were playing drift, the outside backs were playing man-on-man and the fat lad on the right wing was playing a blitz defence - stepping in. The stepping in defence literally created three tries for Hull on Saturday. It is a very effective method if the whole team are playing it, but if only one person is doing it then it tends to fall to pieces.

Some 'constructive' critical points that can be improved as the season moves on, but they do need addressing quite quickly. On the positive side the ability to win first phase possession is a big bonus - but it is then dependent on how you use it!!

Possession
Position
Pressure
Points

Remember them !!!!!!!!!!

[Jez GuscotCarling]

Following these critical swipes at our backs i would like to defend the boys trying to play in the back division.

1. You have 5 of them under 25 - so their experience is all they lack. They play with Grit and Hard hitting attitude.

2 . If you saw them at Leicester they did not miss tackles and big hits was all we saw. (it was the decision making in our 22 that let them down in the last 5 mins.)

3.Some of our players have come from bigger clubs than Orrell not to mention played in International competitions around the world. So these are the best players available at this time.

4. PACE is one thing we dont lack ,its depth that comes from reading the game and reacting to the defence.

5. With the inclusion of Gambles at 10 we have an attacking attitude with a rugby league brain guiding it. But we cannot do much if the forwards are not there for the breakdown and over commit to the ruck or maul.

6 .While many of you were sat in watching Eastenders last night, god decided to give his lawn a watering .you had 25 lads tackling running and getting very soaked to put thing s right for saturday .A win is not on the cards but another step up the ladder is whats going to happen .

7.Lastly did you know that 3 players travel from the other side of the country to help the club . One travels from Kent and another from Doncaster in which he has already been asked to sign for the div 1 club. Two others in the backs have been asked to play a higher level in nat 1 and 2 . But their answers are no!! we are here to play for Orrell . They are putting in the hard work the best way they can . The lads are getting better and two of the clubs we have already played said we are going to be hard to beat in a few weeks .

So until then ... your knowledge of the game is pretty good so 6.30 Thursday bring your boots ,gum shield and see you at training ..
Yours in Rugby . JGC Esq

[Joe]

It's great to get a players insight into things like this. While my comments were intended as constructive, they were not neccessarily right, just my opinion.

As a fan who has been to every game thus far, and also got absolutely soaked last night just dropping some socks off at the training ground, I have obviously noticed the improvements coming thick & fast.

As frustrating as it must be to constantly hear people saying "just give it time", this is the truth of the matter. Leicester was a huge turning point for us I believe and proved that we have the ability to compete at this level, so hopefully as we begin to nail down a regular starting 15 things will really start to change for the better.

All I have ever expected as an Orrell fan is to see a team go out on a Saturday and give it their all... so far, I haven't been let down.

Good luck at the weekend lads.

[jez guscotcarling]

It was not directed at yourself but the statto guest above

[no time]

were going to be to far behind if we give it time

[martin]

Dear jcg

This is 'statto guest'.

As far as i was aware these forums were meant as an opprortunity for all to put their opinions and suggestions forward. That is all that I have done.

I feel that given the fact that i paid my money at the gate then i am entitled to my opinion. Also allied to the fact that i also played the game for 20+ years (mostly at Orrell) and have been coaching for the last 5years my comments my actually be based on a knowledge of the game.

My comments were also mean't to be constructive and that by pointing out the positives as well as the negatives from last saturdays peformance then you might have something to work on, i.e. a gameplan that is suited to your players. From reading your comments it seems that you have a very high opinion of the individuals in the backs, and that is fine, my point was getting them to play together in a team oriented way with a structure that fits in with the whole team. As you say if you are 'passing the ball out to the backs but the forwards can't get to the break down quick enough', is that the forwards fault??? Play to your strengths, gain possession, go forward - first two points in any coaching manual.

i agree with your points about decision making, but i think that this backs up my theory about having better decision makers at 9 & 10. These two should dictate how and where a game is played, however if they are inexperienced then it needs someone to guide them wither on the field or off it.

Another aspect that sprang to my mind after my last post was turnovers, at numerous occasions on saturday a lone hull attacker ran into 3 Orrell defenders who tackled him, unfortunately you did not turn the ball over, in any situation where the defence outnumbers the attack a turnover must be the priority of defenders number 2 & 3.

Finally in response to your point regarding where the players travel from - I find this completely irrelvevant. They need to be prepared for the game come what may.

On a final note from what I saw last week - you do have the ability to stay in this division. you need the belief and you need to back up on the pitch the belief the supporters have in you off the pitch.

Please take this advice in the spirit that it was intended, formulate a game plan to win each game. The fans are not really concerned with the way that you play, if you win every game from now to then end of the season 6-3 and don't score another try then the fans will be over the moon.

Increase the passion and increase the belief. The public of Orrell will get behind a winning team. Promise you.

P.S. as far as getting my boots and gum shield!! you're havin a larff, too many years on the clock, not enough petrol in the tank and plus Eastenders is on!!!

seriously, all the best - you are capable of doing it.

[jgc]

sorry for my mooooood swing but it made me laugh how saturday people were getting at the guys. it was only a few years ago that i was in a gold and blue kit battling it out for the title for worcester against orrell . i have heard so much from both people who shout even when times are going well and those who follow a die hard team . your qualities as mine are are positive in every way wanting the team to do well ,frustration comes to mind and believe me some of us cant be in every position to put it right . so thanks for your comments , ive listened and its on board as for too old and no gas Bently showed us what you can still do to enjoy yourself . yours in the game , a newly named vet