LONGTON 49-5 ORRELL

[Joe]

Although I didn't go I heard it was another abysmal performance. Entirely amateur are Longton by the way

[jimmyboy]

This is a major blow. What the hell is going on.

[Jon B]

I was there and for tonight at least refrain from commenting further....

[jimmyboy]

If the performance reflects the score or vise versa then silence is golden.

[Duncan Macpherson]

Have you seen the explanation by our coach on the TOSAS website? It puts the game into perspective and shows that Chris knows what he's doing.
The league has to be the priority and Chris knows what he is doing. It is a massive mountain to climb but I, for one, think we have a splendid coach who is melding a good team and embuing them with more spirit and resolve than we have seen in previous seasons. What they lack is experience and Chris is obviously sorting out the wheat from the chaff.
Give the lads a break fellas and trust the coach.

[jimmyboy]

I understand that the league has to be prority but Longton are a league below and a win would have brought much needed funds into the club. Every game has to be treated like a cup final and if you think that you can turn performances on and off like a tap you have to be mistaken.

[Gateman]

This is the 3rd season on the trot where members have had to stand there every Saturday afternoon and take their punishment. 2 seasons ending in relegation and this season deja vu is the order of the day. It's not easy. Where and when will the turning point come one begs the question? 70 odd points conceded last week, 29 scored. 49 this week and five scored. I remember a recent posting referring to 29 scored, which said "at least it shows we can score, just tidy up our defence".{Might have been on the Tosa's Forum}. When is the bullsh*t going to stop. Is there a Guinness Book of excuses we refer to every week? To lose to a lesser club like this at the weekend is a disgrace, and reading press reports, "this was only a cup tie, we can now focus on the league" is not an option for me. I've said it before and I'll say it again, "Anyone been to Vienna? Three seasons out of three is consistant. Goodnight.

[Joe]

I think I can whole-heartedly agree with you Gateman. There comes a point when the excuses have to stop, we're not that stupid at the end of the day.

[suffering supporter]

Just goes to show amateur does work where are all you guys now just wasting money that the volunteers are working hard to raise
get out of edgehall road as soon as poss go amatuer and find our true level only then will we become the community club we keep crowing about. how can you be a community club operating out of two different pitches no club house and a public house as your meeting place . not much oppertunity to give the fans and community any involvement is there, I know we will have to build our clubhouse in the future but this is the heart of the club and half our supporters would enjoy good nights in a true rugby club the banter in the club house keeps the club going, And before all the wise guys come on saying I am stating the obvious then yes the obvious needs addressing and nobody seems to want to do that lets get back to the shed with a bar full of Orrell members we dont need a million pound club just a room we can call our own and good John Buer type rugby club food then we will pull in the volunteers when families are involved,wives and girlfriends feel that the club is theres as well

[Joe]

I would like to say bollocks to your opinion on amateurism and also ask how you can conclusively prove that the club would pull in so many volunteers, families etc. Success isn't as simple as yourself.

[Gateman]

With respect Joe, and I'm not going to get into any debates about amateurism/professionalism, but there is some substance in what our guest has just posted. {Yet another nameless guest at that}.You ask your good father about the club in the past when everyone pulled together and when money was a dirty word. I know what you are going to say, and yes it's all history and we can't keep looking over our shoulders, but there was more of a family atmosphere then. We were known amongst the best in the land as being a family run club. Monies from Club Dinner Dances, Corporate Hospitality, Matchball Sponsorship, Major Sponsorship, in fact every penny raised from whatever source all went to the running of the club rather than players' wages. So it can work in both cases. The first piece in the jigsaw is new a club and training venue then we take it from there.

[Ormskirk Player]

I'm sorry i dont have the full background of the club but I know if your club went amature it would be are league you would end up in and a club like Orrell should never get to a league as low as this.
To be in the big leagues you need to spend money thats the way sports is now, Ormskirk is what Mr Gateman was talking about but you have to think would you ever want to be like my club?

[Club volunteer]

As an amateur club volunteer I have to say if my club started paying player's I'd withdraw my services.

Why should I work my arse off so that players with no commitment can get paid?

On the other hand if you want to succeed at the top level you have to get the top players and these days that means professionalism.

All credit to your supporters and volunteers for sticking by you but if you are struggling in this league against amateur clubs maybe you need to look at alternative structures and ways of working?

I have no real expertise on this but if your players aren't committed to the club for "real" reasons like your supporters are, and they can see that the club is struggling on the non-playing side, I can see why they wouldn't be playing at their best.

Also I doubt very much that Longton are "entirely amateur" in the way clubs at my level are but they play for the club, for each other and for the sport - not for the money!

At the end of the day maybe money isn't tyhe biggest incentive

[Jon B]

I agree in a way. I don't see why there has to be either one way forward or the other...with no compromise. I believe there can be both professional & amateur together in one club. I think that in this day and age to compete at a level that Orrell is at (no disrespect to any other amateur clubs intended), you have to be at least semi-professional but there is absolutely nothing stopping Orrell having a very successful amateur side as well.

As I've said before, there are several extremely important benefits to having an amateur side but I don't believe the whole club must be amateur to create a great social & family atmosphere. At the end of the day I want to see a successful Orrell Rugby "CLUB", where we do have the great family atmosphere and social side as well as a successful semi-pro 1st XV, amateur side (2nd team, 3rd, etc.) as well as a booming colts and junior section involving the local community.

It saddens me greatly that there seems still to be splits within the club and that we seem so fragmented at times into the various 'factions'. Maybe I just live in a dream world or have not been around long enough to see what drove such huge wedges between certain sections in this club. But maybe it's time now to forget all that crap and pull together in one direction. Maybe some of us new fans can see some great potential in this great club if we can just stop bickering, back biting and what at times seems to me like we're working against each other.

People have to learn to be more open and frank. We should all be here for the same reasons and that's to see Orrell survive and prosper but at times I feel like I'm bashing my head against a brick wall and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

The most important thing for us now is to improve ON the field. Those that bother to support the club by turning up to watch home matches (no disrespect to those who physically can't make it or are affected by distance) will have seen that we are creating a great atmosphere off the field but we must start to win. Not just to survive in national league rugby but to stop the rot and the haemorrhaging of fans away from Orrell because without fans, there is no club!!

We do need to concentrate on making a permanent break now from EHR and to sever all ties with 'he who shall remain nameless for fear of entering into a torrent of abusive language'. I know we have a sub-committee dedicated to this cause and have every faith in them finding a satisfactory solution.

We need to win.....now!! Many of the lads know this and I could see the look of despair on their faces when they left the field on Saturday...and a personal thanks from me to those who made the effort to speak to me after the match. These are the lads who you know care about ORRELL and are playing for the club. I don't have any answers....but I hope someone does.

COME ON ORRELL !!!

[Joe]

What a great response to my honest but rather crude post. You all make very good points but it's high time we acted on these thoughts instead of just pointing them out.

First step - get out of Edge Hall Road. As a quick-fix way of making some money, we could sell our story to the press (and take it from me, there is much national interest in us) and from that financial income and publicity, drive our ground plans forward while sharing with someone like Wigan RU.

The only way for this club to survive the next few years is at another playing facility, and once we have something (no matter how small) we can begin to generate more revenue, get more sponsors involved and get back that great 'Orrell atmosphere'.

I tell you this - we are the children of the revolution! Whelan may have taken our clubhouse, our ground and our best players, but he'll never take our FREEDOM!!!